About this episode
Cesar Millan is a world-renowned dog behavior expert. We discuss how to adjust your energy and behavior to ensure your dog is calm and happy and always follows your lead. Cesar shares specific tools for: returning home to your dog each day, structuring their walks, and eliminating aggressive behaviors and anxiety. We discuss how to determine if your dog is front, middle, or back of the pack order—a hardwired feature that determines much of their needs and personality. And we explore how human-human interactions are based on balances in energy, too. Both dog owners and non-owners will gain extremely valuable insights and tools from this episode. Read the episode show notes at hubermanlab.com. Pre-order Protocols: https://protocolsbook.com Thank you to our sponsors AG1: https://drinkag1.com/huberman LMNT: https://drinklmnt.com/huberman Joovv: https://joovv.com/huberman Eight Sleep: https://eightsleep.com/huberman Function: https://functionhealth.com/huberman Timestamps (00:00:00) Cesar Millan (00:03:54) Animal Instincts & Human Energy (00:06:31) Spirit, Sending Energy, Tool: Silence, Calm & Confident (00:16:48) Sponsors: LMNT & Joovv (00:19:30) Walking Dog; Pack Order, Tool: Picking a Puppy (00:26:44) Human & Dog Hierarchy; Greeting Dog, Tool: No Look, No Touch, No Speak (00:35:11) Calm Dog, Structured Walk, Tool: Weighted Backpack (00:44:17) Sponsor: AG1 & Eight Sleep (00:46:57) Exercise, Discipline & Affection (00:50:23) Relationship to Death, Spirituality (00:55:30) Human Energy, Rescue Dogs; Sensing Stress (01:01:36) Animal Intelligence, Cats; Being a Pack Leader (01:07:27) Calm Greeting, Humanizing Animals, Safety & Security, Anxious Dogs (01:12:41) Safety & Horses, Respecting Dogs; Human Selfishness, Pack Leader (01:21:31) Sponsor: Function (01:23:15) Human Leaders; Pack Order, Prioritizing Affection (01:32:17) Picking Human Partners, Good Pack Leaders (01:44:40) Dog & Testing Boundaries, Tool: Calm & Confidence (01:52:34) Cultivating Self-Awareness & Self-Discipline, Life Values (01:58:02) Clearing Mind, Tool: Cold Plunge (02:02:22) Honoring Pet Death, Celebration, Expressing Sadness (02:12:13) Understanding Energy, Dog Training & Hard Work (02:17:25) Dog Breeds & Exercise, Fostering Dogs; Spay & Neuter, Humping (02:23:50) Petting Dogs; Barking & Destructive Behaviors, Tools: Early Walks, Challenges (02:31:31) Spirit & Instincts, Training Humans; Acknowledgements (02:35:50) Zero-Cost Support, YouTube, Spotify & Apple Follow, Reviews & Feedback, Protocols Book, Sponsors, Social Media, Neural Network Newsletter Disclaimer & Disclosures Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Episode summary
Give your affection to patience, calm, and an open mind; steer dogs away from fight, flight, or avoidance—those are unhelpful states. Welcome to the Huberman Lab.
Welcome to the Huberman Lab, where we explore science and tools for daily life; I’m Andrew Huberman, and today I’m joined by Cesar Millan, the Dog Whisperer. This conversation is for everyone, because dogs respond to our energy and actions far more than words.
His pack-leadership framework transformed my relationship with my first dog, Costello, and I’m using it now with our new bulldog mastiff, Strummer. You’ll hear practical ways to cultivate a clear, calm state that helps dogs and humans feel safe.
You cannot blame instinct; you shape outcomes by the energy you bring. I rely on silence, calm breathing, confident knowledge, timely love, and joy to connect spirit, instinct, heart, and mind so trust, respect, and love can align.
I learned I could send Costello approval or disapproval without moving or speaking, and he would respond from across the room. As a neuroscientist I can speculate, but I want your take on what that exchange really is.
Silence and intention are powerful; animals live in instinct and feel energy before sound, so calm, confident presence is the first language. When you hold that, like a cat does with a big dog, you reclaim your power and lead without words.
Everything improved when I led with state, not speech, even in big classrooms; he stayed composed because I brought structure, not celebrity. People would benefit from sensing their own energy this way.
Where I grew up we practiced quiet, breath, and discipline, which later let me walk huge off-leash packs because the leash is secondary to energy. True pack leadership is direction and protection delivered with calm confidence.
On walks, should the dog be beside or behind, and is there ever a case for out front?
Pups learn follow, then play and explore, so walking at your side or slightly behind keeps them in follower mode; daily front position puts them in play-explore and teaches them to lead you. Most families do best with middle-of-the-pack dogs, which breeders can flag or you can spot by who approaches novelty second while the shy ones hang back; true front-of-pack dogs need knowledgeable jobs.
Costello was likely front-of-pack; Strummer feels middle or even back, sweeter and sensitive, which is easier for a home. Can humans assess their own pack position?
Humans can shift: I go to calm surrender to assess, front to give direction, and middle to enjoy; dogs are born fixed in role. Many people default to affection energy, which is weak for leadership.
I practiced no looking, no touching, no talking at reunions, which felt odd but created a calm greeting; why is that crucial?
Meeting, walking, and feeding are sacred rituals, and dogs are wired nose, eyes, then ears, so you greet with quiet presence and let calm arrive before contact. That open mind is when learning sticks.
High-drive working dogs show how unforgiving hierarchy can be; a soldier who softened for a movie night got bit the next day. For home life, what should people do with anxious greetings?
Start by meeting needs: most dogs are under-walked, so lengthen and tailor exercise to energy, not breed, and you can add a backpack once grown. Empty the tank daily and build impulse control with simple rules like waiting for food.
Teaching inhibition early paid off—no skin in the mouth ever, and food waits until I release; that carries over everywhere. Why do people resist this?
Guilt and convenience derail structure, and yards become zoos because circles are not migration; nature says dogs walk. Watch the blind and the unhoused: their dogs self-place beside or behind, off leash, because the human’s energy is clear; practice the reunion-walk-feed rituals for weeks before social play.
Our routine is walk, training, then affection, but many would rather cuddle first and stare at phones on the walk. I think that laziness and distraction confuses dogs.
Discipline simply means structure, not punishment, and the walk is a time to connect with earth and spirit, not technology. When you hold that presence, dogs naturally follow the calm bubble you create.
You said in many countries death is visible early, so spirituality comes first; how does that shape how people carry energy?
Living with death teaches surrender to a higher power and to nature’s order, so our hierarchy is spirit first, earth second, then work, family, and love. That foundation steadies the mind.
Here we’re taught that stuff and status drive joy. Dogs taught me to drop that mask.
Happiness with little comes from living natural, simple, and profound; animals do not care about money, fame, or degrees.
Costello never cared that I was the professor; that helped me see people past uniforms and titles. Dogs strip away our stories.
In homes, people tell stories, but dogs show the truth of the energy and habits inside; I teach owners to prize silence and calm, then reward. Rescues pivot fast when given safety, structure, and work before affection.
We fixate on human-like tricks and then humanize dogs. That often backfires.
Humanizing soothes the owner, not the dog; better to build acceptance across species and channel predator energy with clear rules to avoid harm and lawsuits. Bring Strummer to my ranch and we’ll assess his prey drive among other animals.
Before each episode I pray to arrive calm; calm is a practice, not a trait. People and dogs can learn it.
Animals will not choose anxiety, and they will not follow unstable energy; be patient, calm, confident, loving, and joyful, and do a doorway check-in so you reward calm, not chaos.
Many still crave the explosive reunion because it feels like love, but it makes dogs uneasy; language shapes behavior, so simple phrases help us do the right thing.
That cuddle-on-entry nurtures anxiety and often covers owner guilt; more dogs is wonderful if people learn energy, philosophy, and action, and like with horses, prioritize safety, walk at your side, then feed once calm.
Honor dogs as dogs. Build safety, calm, trust, and respect first, then add affection; that order keeps everyone balanced.
We keep trying to make dogs human, which is selfish. Your book snapped me out of that and showed me to meet my dog in his language, not mine.
When you enter a space, hold back from eye contact, chatter, and petting, and let their nose come to you. Patience, quiet, and steady confidence are the real marks of leadership.
Public leaders win by sounding certain, not by showing the steadiness you describe, and we all see how that goes.
Animals judge energy and actions, not speeches; humans get seduced by words. With dogs I skip the talk and deliver calm deeds.
Primates show our worst impulses, while dogs are reliably loyal; the urge to cuddle is strong, but pack structure is care, not cruelty.
Affection-only often pushes the dog to the front and the family to the back. Leadership is loving when it sets rules and timing for affection.
Households differ, but dynamics are always an agreement, spoken or not.
I stopped chasing happy wife, happy life and earned calm leadership instead. Direction and protection come from patience and composure, not pressure.
Friends want different things in partners, and the language around hierarchy can sound harsh, but it is part of human nature.
At the instinct level I lead so my partner feels safe and peaceful, and I work to deserve that role every day.
Did that clarity come after your divorce or during the next relationship?
I changed my philosophy, chose a woman powerful in business who wanted to relax at home, and I earned that trust; I had to unlearn macho lessons and rebuild myself.
I grew up in a power struggle too, and I want no fight or flight at home anymore.
I came from rigid roles, then learned to refine energy, beliefs, and actions; crossing a border on instinct, later guided by stoic practice and daily body language.
My dog tests my girlfriend more than me; how do we even that out?
Lead with silence, breathing, and a clear A to B intention instead of emotions or debate. It is a human skill, not a gender one, and calm confidence corrects what love alone cannot.
You said society drifts from itself on purpose; why?
Confusing information splits the pack; shared truths about dogs, God, and earth unite us no matter our income.
For people trying to slow down in real life, what daily practice builds that calm?
Remember life is about living well, wise use of time, and the memories you carry; be grateful, learn, serve, and love your own spirit, instincts, and mind. To quiet the mind quickly, use cold water to ride adrenaline into calm surrender and carry that state into every interaction.
Cold reliably spikes adrenaline, quiets strategy for a bit, then brings lasting dopamine; that steady state is exactly what dogs and families need.
A good long walk feeds spirit, instincts, heart, and mind, and leaves a durable good feeling.
At the end of a dog's life, is it okay to show sadness or does that make their passing harder?
Give them a joyful send-off in a favorite place and release your tears away from them so they can go peacefully; I see death as returning to source. Therapy dogs absorb heavy energy, so help them clear it after, or reset yourself in cold water before you lean on them.
Online rules clash about beds, hugs, and carrying; is it really about state and intention?
Yes, do those things when the dog is calm and invited, not anxious or territorial; clear family agreement and higher, steadier energy create effortless follow. Start days with quiet, composure, and structure before affection and most problems disappear.
A friend in a stressed household wants two husky puppies to fix things; I warned her not to.
Foster first to test readiness; huskies need migration-level work and more dogs mean much longer walks. In the U.S., spay or neuter often prevents frustration and helps curb overpopulation.
Petting speed, barking, and mornings all seem context dependent.
Match touch to the setting, celebrate in sport and soothe in restaurants; nonstop barking and destruction are usually trapped energy, so walk at sunrise, use the walk to build calm surrender, add novel challenges, and use treadmills only as a backup. Be your dog’s coach across spirit, instinct, heart, and mind, and earn off-leash trust.
Cesar, thank you for the wisdom and palpable calm you brought today; you help us care for dogs and become better humans. For links to his work, see the show notes, and please subscribe on YouTube, follow on Spotify and Apple, leave a rating and review, and drop questions in the YouTube comments.